Exclusive — Schlapp’s Lia Thomas Comments Show Conservatives Struggling to Navigate Politics of Discussing Transgenderism

Matt Schlapp, American Conservative Union Chairman introduces Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis at
(AP Photo/John Raoux)(AP Photo/Chris Szagola)
Katherine Hamilton

Conservatives online attacked Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) host American Conservative Union (ACU) Chairman Matt Schlapp this week for using “gender-affirming” language when talking about how transgender University of Pennsylvania swimmer Lia Thomas “deserves our compassion.”

Schlapp, in response, told Breitbart News he was not trying to use the language of the left — but was simply trying to show compassion to Thomas. The episode shows how conservatives across the movement are attempting to navigate the political minefield that is discussing transgenderism, highlighting the consequences — intended or otherwise — of language choice.

“No matter what one thinks of Lia’s ability to swim with women her story deserves our compassion. It will be interesting to hear Lia’s pov in 30 years,” he tweeted on March 6, sharing a link to a New York Post article about Sport’s Illustrated’s exclusive interview with Thomas. [emphasis added].

For background, Lia Thomas (formerly known as Will) is a man who believes he is a woman and has competed on the school’s men’s swim team for nearly three years. “Lia” has since joined the UPenn women’s team despite numerous complaints from inside and outside the university and has been smashing records — many unlikely to be broken by female competitors.

At least 16 Ivy League female swimmers say they have been afraid to publicly speak out against the pro-transgender university officials who are helping Thomas swim in their competitions, according to the Washington Post. Thomas, who has not undergone any surgical procedures to “transition” and is allegedly attracted to women sexually, also has reportedly walked around the locker rooms with his male genitalia exposed, making his female teammates uncomfortable, the Daily Mail reported.

Schlapp, who worked as White House director for political affairs under President George W. Bush and has led the ACU, which has hosted CPAC for several years, defended his original post on Tuesday via Twitter after receiving pushback, calling it a “false controversy,” and saying he does not “wish to normalize it but simply deal w it w compassion [sic]. He added that conservatives should “defend girls sports against competing w men aggressively but in the end remember that all people deserve respect.” [sic]

The Vice President of the American Conservative Union (ACU), Dan Schneider, also took to Twitter to defend Schlapp. Schneider did not account for Schlapp’s use of “she/her” pronouns, but he wrote that compassion is “what Jesus taught,” without further explaining, according to scripture, that Jesus never told his followers to compromise what is true in the name of “compassion.” 

“We @CPAC have always taken a principled position on marriage and identity. We also maintain our view that ALL people are deserving of dignity and respect. This is the heart of conservatism (both classical conservatism and classical liberalism). It is also what Jesus taught,” Schneider wrote. 

The Blaze’s Allie Stuckey, a conservative Christian who hosts the “Relatable” podcast, had several points of contention with both Schneider’s and Schlapp’s comments. 

“I am not sure the principled position is calling a man ‘her,’ or saying that it will be interested to hear the perspective of someone who is accused of flashing his genitals to women in the locker room,” Stuckey wrote.

“If you’re a conservative, and you’ve been duped into believing calling a man ‘she’ is the ‘compassionate’ approach, I have to wonder if you have any understanding of anything that’s going on at all. It’s hard to imagine being that out of touch,” she continued.

“Enablement isn’t compassion,” author and mathematician James Lindsay joined in. “Every woman in the pool with ‘Lia’ is tacitly required to ‘affirm’ ‘Lia.’ ‘Lia’ already has a pool to swim in. Affirmation of this kind is compelled in addition to normalizing and damaging.”

“.@mschlapp adopting the terminology of the left. Here is a rule of logic Mr. Schlapp: X is not non-X, even if you call it non-X. You can show kindness without suspending reality. #txlege,” wrote Matt Schaefer, a member of the State of Texas House of Representatives.

In an exclusive interview with Breitbart News via phone on Tuesday, Schlapp cordially addressed the flurry of online contention following his post, calling Twitter a “dangerous vehicle, oftentimes because you can only use so many characters.”

“People can misinterpret, and if anybody misinterpreted CPAC’s commitment to ending the war and confronting the war on gender, keeping this whole idea of gender confusion out of our classrooms and doing everything we can to protect girls and women’s sports, then that’s unfortunate, and I’d like to clarify the fact that I think we’re leading voice and all that,” he said.

Schlapp explained his intentions for tweeting in favor of “compassion” for Thomas — he said the specific part of the article that quoted Thomas’ father caused him to sympathize with what the family has gone through during Thomas’ “transition.”

The line from the story goes:

We will do everything and anything we need to do to have Lia be a part of this family,” Thomas’ father, Bob, told Sports Illustrated. “We were not going to lose her.”

“As the father of five — and I think parents everywhere can feel compassion toward the agony that must happen in a family when this occurs,” Schlapp explained. “And so the initial tweet was just to express sympathy for people not only who are confronting gender confusion, but their parents and their siblings — because if, you know, if you look at the stories around this, there’s a lot of sadness.”

Breitbart News asked Schlapp why he referred to Thomas as “her” in his tweet and whether he intends to continue referring to Thomas by his “preferred pronouns.” The first time, Breitbart News asked verbatim: “Do you think using someone’s preferred pronouns constitutes sympathy and compassion in your view?” Schlapp did not directly answer the question about pronouns but affirmed his position on men in women’s sports.

“Well, let me just be clear. I think that you can’t alter your gender. You can have surgeries, you can change your physical appearance, but your gender is immutable,” he answered. “And I believe that your gender should determine whether or not you compete in women’s sports, and a biological male should not compete in those meets and those activities.”

“I think we should be fierce in our defense of women’s sports and biological men should not be allowed to compete in those activities,” he continued when asked whether he believes conservatives can have sympathy for transgendered individuals while also supporting sex-exclusive sports teams. “But at the same time, we should treat people with decency, and we try to do that every day at CPAC, and we’re going to keep doing that.”

Breitbart News asked Schlapp if, going forward, he is going to refer to Lia Thomas as a “her.” Schlapp did not answer the question directly.

“I believe that you can’t change your biology no matter what surgery you get… you can’t change your gender — it’s immutable,” he said in response. “I don’t believe that because you’re an athlete and you believe you have transitioned to a new gender that that should allow you or qualify you to compete against women in their sports. And I think we have to fight that hard.”

“Including the way we address them as ‘he’ or ‘her’ or? —” Breitbart News pressed.

Schlapp again did not directly answer the question about pronouns and (without apparently realizing it) called Thomas “she” again.

“It’s a very fair question, and I think for purposes of the law and for purposes of status as athletes, what they prefer to be called is not as relevant as what their gender actually is,” he said. “And that’s what should determine what competition they compete in. And she should compete with the men. Wait, you have got me caught there — Lia should compete with the men.”

Schlapp released a statement on his Twitter before Breitbart News published this interview, reaffirming that CPAC believes “in fiercely defending girls and women’s sports at every level.”

“The left’s war on gender must be confronted and CPAC will continue to do just that. And we will continue to demonstrate decency to all those involved,” the statement reads in part.

Breitbart News also reached out to Natasha Chart, who worked in a radical feminist organization for years and is a critic of the transgender movement. Chart said she believes Schlapp’s compassion may be “a little misplaced.”

“Every person deserves compassion for their struggles. But it really astonishes me how much a small handful of men [have] been able to completely take the spotlight away from what’s really their cruelty to women to engender support from other men,” she said.

Chart continued: “He’s talking about looking with compassion on a man who is stealing sports titles from women, who is with the full sanction and authority of school officials, who is exposing young women in their locker room to male nudity when we’ve just had a very large and you know, emotionally shattering series of sex abuse scandals in the sporting world where young women were silenced for years by authorities.”

Chart noted that people are often dangerously duped into using “preferred pronouns” because doing so is seen as “pro-social” and “generous.”

“There are a lot of people who want to use what they call preferred pronouns or inaccurate pronouns in order to be kind, and I understand the impulse to be kind. It’s pro-social. It’s generous. You want to make everyone feel respected,” she said. “But in this situation, you have to look at what’s happening and whether it’s kind in this situation to essentially support a social fiction — a lie.”

She continued: “If Lia Thomas is a ‘she,’ what’s the problem? What’s the problem that he changes with the women. If he’s ‘she,’ what’s the problem that he competes with the women. You can’t clearly express the issue if you can’t use accurate words about it.”

Additionally, Breitbart News asked Schlapp for comment on a recent investigation from The National Pulse, which found that the ACU, which hosts CPAC, took a $183,250 grant in 2020 from a “leading left-wing fund” called the New Venture Fund for “civil rights, social action, [and] advocacy.” According to the report, which cited the Atlantic magazine, the New Venture Fund is a “Massive Progressive Dark-Money Group” that has ties to billionaire Democrat megadonor George Soros.

Schlapp did not confirm himself whether the organization gave ACU money, though he said he was “happy to check.” He did, however say that organizations do not have influence over CPAC and the ACU just because they make a donation. 

“That’s one of the good things about when a conservative organization succeeds is you are no longer reliant on any particular donor or donors generally because it’s coming from all over the country,” he said. “And the thing I’m the most proud about is it’s coming in small amounts as well, which demonstrates grass roots success….”

He added that if left-wing donors wanted to “weaken our position” on keeping men out of girls’ sports, “they are failing.”

“So they should ask for a refund, cause we’re not doing a very good job of doing their bidding,” he said. 

Katherine Hamilton is a political reporter for Breitbart News. You can follow her on Twitter.

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